1- when uma’s screaming and crying after coming out of the coma–after seeing KB a million times–i’ve come to like this part. but the 1st couple times it just seemed too long and drawn out–almost beyond the point of inspiring sympathy…it just feels sort of uncomfortable. i guess it’s supposed to, but it almost makes you want to laugh…anyone get this?
2- after uma escapes the hospital, that isaac hayes jam that’s playing while she’s looking for the pussy wagon stops abruptly when it cuts to her getting in the truck. usually QT coordinates the action w/ the music brilliantly…but this part seems weird, maybe it’s because the reel ends at that cut…
i guess i’ll see when the dvd comes out(side note: a good example in KB of the music syncing is that scene on the plane with the al hirt trumpet piece—how Q cut in uma’s butt shot when the music changes a tad to a sexy burlesque sounding tone----AWESOME!)
i’m sure there are other awkward moments, but these are the 1st two i could think of…
thoughts??
This is a good topic.
I agree with your statement on The Bride crying for her baby. I think QT did that on purpose though. It was supposed to bring everyone in the audience to a certain common ground the way its timed out I think. I could feel the same thing when I watched it. Lots of ideas/emotions are layered in Kill Bill Vol 1 thats for damn sure. ÂÂ
The cut when The Brides looking for the truck and the way the music cuts was also done on purpose I think. QT/Sally are masters at cutting film scenes together, I think he wants Kill Bill to have elements of a B movie even in terms of editing.
If you watch old Exploitation movies there are in fact scenes that arent cut together well. They have music playing, then cut to the next scene with no music playing etc.
An awkward moment I felt was during the split screen sequence when we see The Brides eye and inserts of Elle Driver dressing into her nurses outfit. It almost seemed that there was some sexual message in there. Like lesbian undertones between Elle and The Bride or something. It was sexy but strange. Whatever it was, the split screen effect worked on me. I loved the way QT put that together.
[quote]1- when uma’s screaming and crying after coming out of the coma–after seeing KB a million times–i’ve come to like this part. but the 1st couple times it just seemed too long and drawn out–almost beyond the point of inspiring sympathy…it just feels sort of uncomfortable. i guess it’s supposed to, but it almost makes you want to laugh…anyone get this?[/quote]
I get what you’re trying to say though I have to disagree with laughing about it. I think it’s meant as an uncomfortable moment and if it was any shorter I would think it would be crap: because she almost died and she lost her loving baby, you don’t just process this in 2 seconds. That’s why I appreciate the emotional value of this part: she’s crying for a while in silence, no cool track on the background just uma and her sorrow.
the first time i saw it i kinda shifted in my chair (which is the uncomfortable effect the scene is imho trying to accomplish), but the times after that I could really enjoy the i would almost ssay beauty of the scene, it’s well done. But I never felt like laughing. when she taps the iron plate in her head, that was pretty funny the first time, but as soon as she reaches for her stomach, I’m there with her.
I didn’t find Uma crying for her lost baby at all amusing, nor uncomfortable. That was very well acted, and it made me want to cry and feel for her. But, I don’t really consider that an uncomfortable feeling.
What did make me feel uncomfortable was the very opening scene with The Bride and Bill. The bullet to the head was just the icing on the cake for “uncomfortableness.”
around when the sheriff got out of his car it was cut alittle weird, but yeah i hear ya on those moments you mentioned in the first post
good point. indeed the intro had that uncomfortable thing going. But I consider the crying scene as either touching or uncomfortable:
people who can feel this stuff, find it touching, emotional, want to cry. that’s the feeling i got about the movie at later viewings.
if you can’t deal with this stuff, it’s uncomfortable, it unsettles you. But I don’t think this is bad. Because it is very well acted: you watch a woman crying about the loss of her baby (and she doens’t even realise how she in fact really lost). how can you cope with this? you don’t meet crying ‘lost a baby’ women everyday. so it could be uncomfortable. that’s what I had the first viewing.
but I don’t get the laughing element but different people react differently.
Awkward scenes? Hmm.
Nothing got more awkward for me than the first time I watched the movie and the Ironside theme was played right at the begining (the part that made me cringe was the cheezy ta da da daaaaaa right before Uma punches Fox) of the Vernita/Bride fight sequence. To Kung Fu geeks, I’m sure it was a blast, but I’m not one of those people. The only reason I went to KB wasn’t so much for the Blaxploitation or Kung Fu elements, but for the Japanese and Spahgetti Western elements. Anyway, that scene is one of those awkward moments that you just get used to the more you watch it, though.
The scene after Vernita dies where the Bride is talking to the kid is pretty awkward. Pretty much due to the writing more than the actual direction or acting.
The scene where Uma wakes up and starts crying is pretty awkward, too, but just because it didn’t seem like something QT was gonna lay on the audience in what I initially assumed to just be a mindless revenge flick with some great style.
Oh, and that “Silly rabbit, Trix are for kids” line was the only other (and final) awkward bit of writing/direction in the movie. Yeah, I know QT likes to include pop culture in his work, but it just looked like he was trying too hard, and coming up with nothing. That, and I don’t think I’ve seen a Trix ad on television in like four or five years.
Anyway, most of these cases don’t have anything to do with QT’s style or direction, just his writing. But after knowing this movie was going to be a Kung Fu flick, and particularly after reading the script, I think we all knew this was going to be QT’s weakest effort as a writer. Of course, the weakness of writing is ultimately balanced out by the production being his greatest effort as a director, which is what he wants us to view him as anyway (“A director that writes his own stuff” as he put it when asked wether or not he viewed himself as a writer).
[quote]Awkward scenes?  Hmm.
The scene where Uma wakes up and starts crying is pretty awkward, too, but just because it didn’t seem like something QT was gonna lay on the audience in what I initially assumed to just be a mindless revenge flick with some great style.[/quote]
well, i guess he caught us off guard with that shit. that’s why I like Kill Bill because it’s so much more than the above. And I don’t know if you liked the movie, but even you if you didn’t came in and watched it for the kung fu/fighting elements, you can still get a blast out of it. It has all these elements from all these movies. gr8.
the bride - Nikky (or nikkia or something) - that was pretty ackward yeah. but especially for the bride who suddnely sees this child. QT adds a little samurai/revenge code here, when the bride tells the girl that she’ll be waiting if revenge is what she seeks. luckily she didn’t get even, even steven. because that would mean that she would kill the kid and the father: that would’ve been ackward.
[quote]
well, i guess he caught us off guard with that shit. that’s why I like Kill Bill because it’s so much more than the above. And I don’t know if you liked the movie, but even you if you didn’t came in and watched it for the kung fu/fighting elements, you can still get a blast out of it. It has all these elements from all these movies. gr8. [/quote]
Oh, I love the movie, and am very gung ho about it. Its just that I prefer the Samurai stuff at the end to the more “traditional” exploitation/grindhouse stuff at the begining.
[quote]the bride - Nikky (or nikkia or something) - that was pretty ackward yeah. but especially for the bride who suddnely sees this child. QT adds a little samurai/revenge code here, when the bride tells the girl that she’ll be waiting if revenge is what she seeks. luckily she didn’t get even, even steven. because that would mean that she would kill the kid and the father: that would’ve been ackward.
[/quote]
Yeah, it was going to be awkward and was going to alienate viewers no matter what, but I still felt the dialogue just sounded…for lack of a better word…“wierd” coming out of Uma Thurman’s mouth in English. After all of the vernacular used up to that point, so a proper, thought out comment just was odd and kinda out of place.
The beginning when we hear Uma breathing heavily, sounding like she’s gettn it from behind, was the most awkward part for me. Not because I didn’t know what was going on, I knew what it was all about, but for all my buddies who hadn’t read the script or didn’t know much about Kill Bill, they probably thought this was gonna be some kinda soft porn flick. Even the audience (a couple times) laughed during the sequence. But then they discover what exactly is happening to The Bride and that laughing was all for nothing. That’s awkward to me. And definitely the cold silence after The Bride wakes up from her coma. The first time I saw it I was like…"ok yah we all feel bad…kept dragging…“yah thats horrible”…kept dragging…“Quentin this is goin on too long man!” I can appreciate and do appreciate that scene, but like I said, for the non-Tarantino fans, It was probably a little awkward.
yeah I know what you mean. It does show that she hasn’t lost her cool and maintains calm and considerate.
[quote]yeah I know what you mean. It does show that she hasn’t lost her cool and maintains calm and considerate.[/quote]
The problem is the Ironside theme, Shaw Bros zoom, the pulsing vein in the forehead (as written in the script), the cursing, etc. all seemed to suggest everything she did and said in that first scene was heavily laden with emotion and anger. The fact that the Bride sounds emotionless and is reciting something from a book after such “excess” emotion kinda defeats the whole mood.
The whole theme in the movie is that The Bride has honor and some form of respect for her victims. Whereas most of the other Vipers are lowlifes who dont.
Vernita bushwhacks her again (Kaboom) and still the Bride is calm and collected when she tells Nikki her mom had it coming etc.
The Bride is following the code of the Yagyu Ninja, shes not letting her deep emotions get the best of her when shes getting her revenge.
Puck: You sound like your starting to get those negative feelings out about the film. What took so long? The Ironside theme is cheesy now? Oh jeez. The writing is his worst work so far? You still think QT didnt know EXACTLY what he was doing when he wrote it? WOW.
I dont know what to tell you man. I love every bit of that movie.
[quote]
The cut when The Brides looking for the truck and the way the music cuts was also done on purpose I think. QT/Sally are masters at cutting film scenes together, I think he wants Kill Bill to have elements of a B movie even in terms of editing.
If you watch old Exploitation movies there are in fact scenes that arent cut together well. They have music playing, then cut to the next scene with no music playing etc.
[/quote]
Reel change, my friends, reel change.
How many times have you gone to the movies and (During the film) you catch a circular object in the upper corner of the screen, then all of a sudden the scene abruptly cuts to the next scene?
This is called the reel change. Sometimes you lose dialogue ÂÂ
from the previous scene or you lose music from the soundtrack (Just like in Kill Bill)
But once we watch this sequence on DVD, we’ll know that the “reel-change cut” was indeed intentional on QT’s part. This just had to have been an in-joke by him to remind filmgeeks of going to the movies…And expecting to see the reel change.  
No awkward complaints from me.
This is not meant as a complaint, on the contrary I loved the part. But an awkward moment that nobody has mentioned yet was in the anime sequence when O-Ren is under the bed and begins to cry; and then the words WHIMPER start to come out of her mouth and then she pushes them back in with her hand. Fuckin’ awesome, shows once again that QT is the master of black comedy.
I happen to agree with Puck 100%. Strictly speaking from a writing persective, this is his worst effort so far. However, that’s not really saying a lot, considering Reservoir Dogs, Pulp Fiction, and Jackie Brown are absolutely brilliant in terms of writing. Kill Bill I felt, was a little bit behind he previous work.
However, as far as direction goes, Kill Bill is the clear cut favorite in this catagory. It will beautifully directed.
[quote]
Puck: You sound like your starting to get those negative feelings out about the film. What took so long? The Ironside theme is cheesy now? Oh jeez. The writing is his worst work so far? You still think QT didnt know EXACTLY what he was doing when he wrote it? WOW.
I dont know what to tell you man. I love every bit of that movie.
[/quote]
I’m not starting to get negative feelings about the film. I still love it. What negative feelings I do have regarding the film as pertains to the writing has been there since I first read the rough draft of the script when it first appeared. I mean, can you honestly say the writing for Kill Bill Volume 1 is better than Reservoir Dogs? Pulp Fiction? Jackie Brown? I know that KB is an entirely different movie from what QT usually does, and I know this is what QT intended for it to be like, but that doesn’t change the fact that this is his WEAKEST bit of writing to date. Its not like I’m saying he’s lost it or anything - he hasn’t - its just that the writing itself - ignoring the direction or overall production - is a step down from Jackie Brown. I don’t see how there’s anything wrong or negative with admitting that. Common sense: a crime drama is going to be better written than a Kung Fu movie.
And, yes! I think the Ironside theme is cheezy! We don’t all have to like Five Fingers of Death and all references to it, do we? Sorry, I’m just not a big Shaw Bros fan.
Anyway, don’t let my posts in a thread title “Awkward Moments” mislead you. I still love the movie, I just prefer everything from the anime segment onward over the first half of the film. I don’t see how there’s anything wrong with that. Its no different than people in the Pulp Fiction forum voicing their opinions that they liked “The Bonnie Situation” segment far more than “The Gold Watch” segment.
No awkward moments for me. I thought the movie was absolutely perfect. In every way.
The only thing that was awkward though was the black and white HOBL scene, but that wasn’t QT’s intention.
[quote] that doesn’t change the fact that this is his WEAKEST bit of writing to date.  Its not like I’m saying he’s lost it or anything - he hasn’t - its just that the writing itself - ignoring the direction or overall production - is a step down from Jackie Brown.  I don’t see how there’s anything wrong or negative with admitting that.  Common sense:  a crime drama is going to be better written than a Kung Fu movie.
And, yes!  I think the Ironside theme is cheezy!  We don’t all have to like Five Fingers of Death and all references to it, do we?  Sorry, I’m just not a big Shaw Bros fan. [/quote]
I guess to each his own. When I read Kill Bill, I felt it was his BEST script so far. Not so much because of the actual dialogue itself (which I feel was MEANT to be somewhat cheap and used to serve the story at hand not to impress the Pulp/Dogs lovers) but because of the storytelling aspect and his unique way of writing a screenplay. I loved every line of it. I also totally enjoyed the looseness and the format which QT used to tell the story. Its a complete Exploitation film.
Of course not everyone is into what some of us are into and thats totally cool. For instance, to me the Ironside theme is totally rockin and fun, not “cheesy”, (which to me is sort of a negative connotation). I grew up watching old school kung fu and Ive always enjoyed the music and the style of those films.
I like all kinds of films in the Exploitation genre, not just samurai films. Thats why I love Kill Bill so much it has little tastes of all of them.
I don’t think the script was weaker, it was just different. I don’t think we should compare Kill Bill with Pulp Fiction or Jackie Brown on any level. We shouldn’t have expected O-ren and the Bride talkin’ about cheeseburgers during the final showdown, ya know what I mean?