Ellroy basically thinks that as a novelist he is a better writer than a pop culture-influenced screenwriter. That is bullshit. He has no right to say that writing novels is more of an artform than what Quentin does.
[quote=“mondo68”]
And yeah, it’s a Tarantino board, but that doesn’t mean we can’t think for ourselves.
[/quote]
What makes you think that I am not thinking for myself? It was my choice to come to a dedicated Tarantino forum. If I didn’t want to, then I wouldn’t have. I admire Tarantino, but not blindly. I didn’t automatically think that Tarantino was better than Ellroy. I just found Ellroy’s argument stupid and uncalled for. If you love Ellroy so much, why don’t you just go to an Ellroy forum.
If QT had become a novelist, he probably wouldve been way better than James Ellroy. Ellroy cant even make movies, but QT can write AND make movies, therefore Ellroy is not on the same level. QT is a modern day Elmore Leonard that can write AND direct. He stands alone.
[quote=“WinslowLeach”]
If QT had become a novelist, he probably wouldve been way better than James Ellroy. Ellroy cant even make movies, but QT can write AND make movies, therefore Ellroy is not on the same level. QT is a modern day Elmore Leonard that can write AND direct. He stands alone.
[/quote]
Seth, how can YOU determine he isnt a great novelist? He never put out a novel!! I believe if he put all his energy into writing books he would be as good as Elmore Leonard. Writing a screenplay is def different than writing a novel, but QT is a master writer, everyone knows that.
QT can spell fine from what Ive seen and even if he couldnt, thats what an editor is for.
Who gives a damn what James Ellroy thinks anyways? Why would a novelist diss a SCREENWRITER? Its because he knows hes great at it. Thats my opinion. So fuck that guy, hes an asshole. Anyone else who thinks QT can’t write great FUCK YOU TOO.
One more thing: Quentin Tarantino spent several years writing a screenplay for Inglorious Bastards (which I’d choose to read over any of Ellroy’s work in a second). I heard its about 600 pages long. You actually think thats not like writing a novel? Its BETTER than a novel because its dialogue and direction. Let James Ellroy pull that shit off, then we’ll talk again. Until then…
[quote=“WinslowLeach”]
If QT had become a novelist, he probably wouldve been way better than James Ellroy. Ellroy cant even make movies, but QT can write AND make movies, therefore Ellroy is not on the same level. QT is a modern day Elmore Leonard that can write AND direct. He stands alone.
[/quote]
You’re comparing two COMPLETELY DIFFERENT art forms as if they’re the same thing. That doesn’t make any sense at all.
You might as well say “Mozart can’t even make movies, but QT can write AND direct movies, therefore Mozart is not on the same level.” See how silly that sounds? Being a novelist and a screenwriter are two entirely different things and you can’t compare them as if they’re not.
And your last two sentences are pretty funny: “QT is a modern day Elmore Leonard,…” (isn’t Elmore Leonard the modern-day Elmore Leonard? He’s still alive you know!), “… that can write AND direct. He stands alone.” (umm, “alone” I guess means him and EVERY OTHER writer/director out there, right?).
C’mon people, admit it, this is a STOOOOPID argument!
Excuse that, I meant modern day as in his generations Elmore Leonard.
Mondo, your Mozart comparison doesnt really relate to this. Theres a difference between comparing two writers and a musician and a writer.
By he stands alone, I meant he stands alone as the best modern day crime film writer-director. Theres good directors out there but not many that work in that genre and who know it back to front AND can write original material and direct it with such brilliance.
To say that being a novelist and a screenwriter are the same thing is evidence that you don’t understand either.
Whatever, Ellroy is great. Tarantino is great. Who the fuck cares if one said something about the other? I’m pretty certain that Tarantino would be embarrassed by this entire argument, so… let’s just say it’s not worth the aggravation.
I definitely understand the diff between what a novelist and a screenwriter is. A novelist writes books, a screenwriter writes scripts to be made into films. But QT definitely brought a novelistic technique to screenwriting. Its general knowledge.
James Ellroy can say whatever he wants, Who cares if he doesnt like pop culture? QT is still great at what he does.
[quote=“WinslowLeach”]
I definitely understand the diff between what a novelist and a screenwriter is. A novelist writes books, a screenwriter writes scripts to be made into films. But QT definitely brought a novelistic technique to screenwriting. Its general knowledge.
James Ellroy can say whatever he wants, Who cares if he doesnt like pop culture? QT is still great at what he does.
[/quote]
I agree with the second part of your post, though I would add "and Ellroy’s great at what he does too."
Anyway, Ellroy only dissed Tarantino because he thinks it is fine to write about 50s pop culture which is irrelevant to today (which somehow transcends mere pop culture…), but it is not okay to talk about pop culture today.
And no, there really is not a difference between screenwriting and novel writing when it all comes down to it. Mondo, you don’t get the point. Everyone is saying that if he spent his time writing novels then he would be better at writing novels. They are not saying that he is the best novel writer at this very moment. But he is a fantastic screenwriter.
And Burroughs, Welsh, Murakami, Leonard, Palahnuik are all better than Ellroy in my opinion. And that is just the tip of the iceberg.
Those who say that Ellroy is great, is that because you personal enjoy his work or because he’s a famous novelist? In other words, is Ellroy great, or is he “great”?
[quote=“WeaselCo”]
I don’t see any difference between a novelist and a screenwriter. It’s basically taking an original idea and putting it into the required format.
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[quote=“Angel”]
Anyway, Ellroy only dissed Tarantino because he thinks it is fine to write about 50s pop culture which is irrelevant to today (which somehow transcends mere pop culture…), but it is not okay to talk about pop culture today.
And no, there really is not a difference between screenwriting and novel writing when it all comes down to it. Mondo, you don’t get the point. Everyone is saying that if he spent his time writing novels then he would be better at writing novels. They are not saying that he is the best novel writer at this very moment. But he is a fantastic screenwriter.
And Burroughs, Welsh, Murakami, Leonard, Palahnuik are all better than Ellroy in my opinion. And that is just the tip of the iceberg.
[/quote]
Really, those who think writing a novel and writing a screenplay are the same thing have clearly never attempted either. To claim that the skills to do each well are interchangable is completely absurd.
Now Angel, there’s a big difference between setting your novels in the 50’s (as Ellroy often does) and spitting out non-stop pop culture references (which is what he doesn’t like about QT). Not the same thing at all. And I won’t argue with you about Burroughs, Welsh, etc., but it’s not like anyone couldn’t name at least five directors who are greater than Tarantino. I mean really, compared to the careers of the great directors, he’s only just getting started. Let’s not go overboard here.
I am a writer. I write a lot. Novels and Screenplays. They may not be the same when it all comes down to it. But they are not worlds apart. And you are still missing the fact that I said “If Tarantino spent time writing novels” he would be far far better in the specific novel arena.
Are you trying to say that writing novels requires more skill than writing screenplays? Cause the real argument here is that writing great screenplays is just as praiseworthy as writing great novels. The argument is not that writing novels and screenplays are the exact same thing. They are very similar, but the point here is that in the amount of talent and work they require they are no different.
And Ellroy sucks hard cock. At least Tarantino is not afraid to say that he likes to watch films that critics deem brainless trash. Ellroy would much rather tell us that he listens to classical music and is therefore an intelligent person. There is nothing stupid or unintelligent about pop culture or exploitation or anything of a similar nature. Ellroy is just too big headed for his own good. I would much rather that he said he did not like Tarantino’s films because they were not his style than act like they are beneath him. That is how this whole argument began. Ellroy assumes that Tarantino is below him and not up to “oh so high” standards. He is just jealous because Tarantino is a household name and he is not.
