DePalma influence?

Talk dogs! The cult-gangster flick. Everything about Reservoir Dogs, when the KBILLY Supersounds of the 70s continue...
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Dantes Inferno
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DePalma influence?

Post by Dantes Inferno » Mon May 21, 2007 2:09 pm

I was thinking... isn't the chainsaw scene in Scarface kinda similar to the ear-scene in RD? Both deal with prisoners about to face a certain and horrible death, but both surprisingly survive in the end. More importantly, both feature a break from the violence (Mr. Blonde stepping outside in RD, camera moving out of the apartment in Scarface), before they go back. In RD, the song (Stuck In The Middle) fades out when he goes out, and fades in when he comes back, same as the chainsaw sound in Scarface fades out and back in as the camera returns. Seeing as QT lists DePalma as a major influence, it may not be too farfetched, I think.

I don't know, do I have a point or am I just rambling?

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Ify » Mon May 21, 2007 2:36 pm

Interesting. Good observation.
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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Cpt tonyanthony » Mon May 21, 2007 3:05 pm

Pepe Serna dies after getting in arm and leg cut off... and eventually so does Marvin.. but, i think you definitely have a point here, especially with the break from the scene and sound fading, even though the final effect is quite different. touché ! ;)

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Jjp » Tue May 22, 2007 9:01 pm

well its not that differant they both make you use your imagination.

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Cpt tonyanthony » Wed May 23, 2007 7:08 am

the tone of the scenes are differents. the camera going outside then coming back is set for different purposes.. In scarface: the camera goes out to make us see that Tony's friend is not doing his job properly and tries to hook up girls instead of checking if everything is doing ok.. In Reservoir Dogs, the shot where Mr Blonde goes out gives us a glimpse to the neighbourhood and the environment where the whole story takes place (he walks next to a house with a backyard and we can hear a kid playing.)

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Bleach » Wed May 23, 2007 7:30 am

Too subtle to be direct influence I think
[img width=500 height=66]http://i41.tinypic.com/9sqlpu.jpg[/img]

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Dantes Inferno » Wed May 23, 2007 4:52 pm

I don't think the tone is different. They are both a break from the action, before bursting back in again. Though I wouldn't call them breaks, as the tension is still high.

And there's a different between influence and homage.
Influence: an idea taken further or used in a different context. Example, after Psycho, most slasher films had an important character dying half-way into the movie.
Homage: an idea half-copied, stolen or whatever, as a tribute.
Last edited by Dantes Inferno on Wed May 23, 2007 4:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Kilgore Trout » Wed May 23, 2007 5:03 pm

Dantes Inferno wrote: I was thinking... isn't the chainsaw scene in Scarface kinda similar to the ear-scene in RD? Both deal with prisoners about to face a certain and horrible death, but both surprisingly survive in the end. More importantly, both feature a break from the violence (Mr. Blonde stepping outside in RD, camera moving out of the apartment in Scarface), before they go back. In RD, the song (Stuck In The Middle) fades out when he goes out, and fades in when he comes back, same as the chainsaw sound in Scarface fades out and back in as the camera returns. Seeing as QT lists DePalma as a major influence, it may not be too farfetched, I think.

I don't know, do I have a point or am I just rambling?
yeah....and every fucking James Bond movie has the same scenario - certain death is avoided - wise observation.

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Dantes Inferno » Wed May 23, 2007 7:25 pm

Okay, so maybe that's not so unordinary. Didn't say it was either. It's the break from the violence that's the similiarity between RS and Scarface. Yes, there are differences, but that's what influence is. Just like the often very slow tempo of Sergio Leone films has influenced QT's work. Pulp Fiction wasn't a western, but it wasn't fast either.

Btw, sorry if I seem pushy about my arguments.  ;D

Jjp

Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Jjp » Wed May 23, 2007 7:40 pm

I'm starting to doubt this whole thing i mean this is like saying every director who likes scarface and put a tortures seen that pulls back in his film is copying and if you look at it they are 2 completely different scenes. but i do think it is a reference to the toxic avenger 2

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Kilgore Trout » Wed May 23, 2007 10:29 pm

Jjp wrote: I'm starting to doubt this whole thing i mean this is like saying every director who likes scarface and put a tortures seen that pulls back in his film is copying and if you look at it they are 2 completely different scenes. but i do think it is a reference to the toxic avenger 2
Toxic Avenger - that movie kicks ass

Jjp

Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Jjp » Wed May 23, 2007 10:30 pm

Kilgore Trout wrote: Toxic Avenger - that movie kicks ass
yes it does!!!

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Tristan » Sun May 27, 2007 3:41 pm

Bleach wrote: Too subtle to be direct influence I think
I wouldn't say a direct influence, but there's definitely something
Kinda cute, kinda hot, kinda sexy and hysterically funny but not funny-looking signature which you could laugh at

Jjp

Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Jjp » Sun May 27, 2007 5:55 pm

Tristan wrote: I wouldn't say a direct influence, but there's definitely something
i disagree i think this has no influence at all on the scene.

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Tristan » Wed May 30, 2007 3:46 pm

you can't deny there's a je-ne sais-quoi in both scenes!
it'd be a sort of unconscious reference...
Kinda cute, kinda hot, kinda sexy and hysterically funny but not funny-looking signature which you could laugh at

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Cpt tonyanthony » Thu May 31, 2007 5:17 pm

Tristan wrote: you can't deny there's a je-ne sais-quoi in both scenes!
it'd be a sort of unconscious reference...
i agree with this

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Kilgore Trout » Thu May 31, 2007 5:54 pm

well, there is a "certain something" that can parallel a porno to psycho, but you don't go around calling skin-flick makers the next Hitchcock - do you?

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Mike Hammer » Thu May 31, 2007 6:40 pm

In Death Proof's end credits Brian De Palma is specially thanked.

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Tristan » Thu May 31, 2007 8:32 pm

Kilgore Trout wrote: well, there is a "certain something" that can parallel a porno to psycho, but you don't go around calling skin-flick makers the next Hitchcock - do you?
no I don't, yet this is interesting, that de palma's quoted in DP'end credits
Kinda cute, kinda hot, kinda sexy and hysterically funny but not funny-looking signature which you could laugh at

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by ToothpickVicVega » Thu May 31, 2007 9:44 pm

Lets see, QT uses the music from Blow Out and gives Special Thanks to DePalma in the credits. Is he influenced by DePalma? Nawwww couldnt be!! DePalma is one of QTs BIGGEST influences, even moreso than Hitchcock.

And that scene in Dogs is DEFINITELY like the chainsaw sequence in Scarface. Both scenes do the same type of thing. They bring you out of the horrific situation and take you into another reality of whats going on outside that situation.

Even the opening of Dogs/diner scene in Death Proof is patterned after the opening of Scarface & the intro of Winslow Leach in Phantom of the Paradise among many others. The continuous circling dolly shot is complete DePalma style.

Id even say DePalma is one of the main directors whose visual style is most influential to QT.

Anyone notice the Scorsese Mean Streets style tracking shot in Death Proof. When Dov and Omar are going to get the girls the drinks? I loved that.
Last edited by ToothpickVicVega on Thu May 31, 2007 9:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Kilgore Trout » Thu May 31, 2007 10:09 pm

welcome back!

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Kiriyama » Fri Jun 01, 2007 4:40 am

PopeyePete wrote: DePalma is one of QTs BIGGEST influences, even moreso than Hitchcock.
But Hitchcock is DePalma's biggest influence, so wouldn't that inadverdently make them equal in terms of influences on Tarantino's films?

Jjp

Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Jjp » Fri Jun 01, 2007 4:42 am

visualsynergy wrote: But Hitchcock is DePalma's biggest influence, so wouldn't that inadverdently make them equal in terms of influences on Tarantino's films?
yes and it would make hitchcock a bigger influence.

Kiriyama

Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Kiriyama » Fri Jun 01, 2007 5:26 am

Cha-ching!

ToothpickVicVega

Re: DePalma influence?

Post by ToothpickVicVega » Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:00 pm

Jjp wrote: yes and it would make hitchcock a bigger influence.
Well not completely. DePalma has his own visual/technical style and his own black comedy persona in film. EVERY director of DePalma/Scorsese/Spielberg's generation was influenced by Hitch, but they do have their own styles now.

All directors learn from their favorite directors, just like Bob Dylan took ideas from all the musicians he admired (Woody Guthrie etc) to find his own style. Thats part of being an artist.
Last edited by ToothpickVicVega on Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Kilgore Trout » Fri Jun 01, 2007 3:19 pm

Hitch was everyone's influence.  That is a no-brainer.  Here are the equivalents of Hitch in their fields:

Jimi Hendrix - guitar
Leonardo DaVinci - art
Napoleon - crazy short dudes ;D

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Dantes Inferno » Fri Jun 01, 2007 3:43 pm

PopeyePete wrote:Even the opening of Dogs/diner scene in Death Proof is patterned after the opening of Scarface
Good call, never thought about that before.

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Tristan » Fri Jun 01, 2007 6:47 pm

Kilgore Trout wrote: Napoleon - crazy short dudes ;D
;D ;D ;D
Kinda cute, kinda hot, kinda sexy and hysterically funny but not funny-looking signature which you could laugh at

Jjp

Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Jjp » Fri Jun 01, 2007 7:24 pm

Dantes Inferno wrote: Good call, never thought about that before.
where the detectives are asking him questions?

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Re: DePalma influence?

Post by Dantes Inferno » Sat Jun 02, 2007 8:07 am

Yep.

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